revtothelimit - motorbike forum

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:35 pm**

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:26 pm
weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:28 am Everything APART from an IL4 for me.

I don't get that, I've got 3 inline 4s and they ride differently, one has 16 valves, one 20 and one 8, my FZR400 is all revs, no appreciable step in power and harder to ride fast than a two stroke, my FZ750 is smooth and sizeable but not powerful up to 8000rpm, then it screams round to 11000 and is quick, my Z1170 makes power from 2000 - 9000 and is all grunt, you can ride round and barely change gear, you can do a lap of Cadwell with about 10 gear changes.

The posts so far show that different people want different things, but also that some people want more than one engine type and enjoy different engine characteristics, I don't want to be limited to one engine type, I want to enjoy the variety of motorcycling.

I enjoy the variety too, I just hate IL4s, the way they sound, the way they scream, the way they make power, everything.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:42 pm**

weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:35 pm
Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:26 pm
weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:28 am Everything APART from an IL4 for me.

I don't get that, I've got 3 inline 4s and they ride differently, one has 16 valves, one 20 and one 8, my FZR400 is all revs, no appreciable step in power and harder to ride fast than a two stroke, my FZ750 is smooth and sizeable but not powerful up to 8000rpm, then it screams round to 11000 and is quick, my Z1170 makes power from 2000 - 9000 and is all grunt, you can ride round and barely change gear, you can do a lap of Cadwell with about 10 gear changes.

The posts so far show that different people want different things, but also that some people want more than one engine type and enjoy different engine characteristics, I don't want to be limited to one engine type, I want to enjoy the variety of motorcycling.
I enjoy the variety too, I just hate IL4s, the way they sound, the way they scream, the way they make power, everything.

But not all IL4s are like that is the point I'm trying to make, modern ones are, but there was a time when IL4s were tuned to be rideable and pleasant, I rode a Suzuki GSF600 (the one that was after the Bandit) and it had the worst bike engine I've ever used, if it was the only inline 4 I'd ever ridden I'd never ride another one, the only V twins I've ridden are a 1994 900SS and a CX500, both were horrible, all v twins can't be that horrible, other wise no one would ride them.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:52 pm**

I tell a lie, I've ridden SV650s quite a lot and liked them

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:53 pm**

weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:35 pm I just hate IL4s, the way they sound, the way they scream, the way they make power, everything.

Try an old BMW K100. Although you will hate the size, weight, handling, brakes, etc, I can assure you that the way it makes power is nothing like a UJM.

It will not scream

Power delivery has more in common with a diesel.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:15 pm**

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:42 pm
weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:35 pm
Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:26 pm

I don't get that, I've got 3 inline 4s and they ride differently, one has 16 valves, one 20 and one 8, my FZR400 is all revs, no appreciable step in power and harder to ride fast than a two stroke, my FZ750 is smooth and sizeable but not powerful up to 8000rpm, then it screams round to 11000 and is quick, my Z1170 makes power from 2000 - 9000 and is all grunt, you can ride round and barely change gear, you can do a lap of Cadwell with about 10 gear changes.

The posts so far show that different people want different things, but also that some people want more than one engine type and enjoy different engine characteristics, I don't want to be limited to one engine type, I want to enjoy the variety of motorcycling.
I enjoy the variety too, I just hate IL4s, the way they sound, the way they scream, the way they make power, everything.
But not all IL4s are like that is the point I'm trying to make, modern ones are, but there was a time when IL4s were tuned to be rideable and pleasant, I rode a Suzuki GSF600 (the one that was after the Bandit) and it had the worst bike engine I've ever used, if it was the only inline 4 I'd ever ridden I'd never ride another one, the only V twins I've ridden are a 1994 900SS and a CX500, both were horrible, all v twins can't be that horrible, other wise no one would ride them.

I've ridden and enjoyed IL4s, back in the day, old and modern ones, from zxr400s to thundercats, gsxr750s to screaming R1s, but they're so far removed from what I want or need from a motorbike engine nowadays.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:21 pm**

I've ridden all the big litre IL4s on track and the GSXR1000 is the most user friendly. There's a reason why I kept buying them

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:42 pm**

Probably easier to say which I liked the least which was a (Honda Hornet) 600 IL4. What an absolute waste of time! Flat as a witches tit below 10k. Constant changing up and down to get anything out of it, or it just bogged down. Hateful thing.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:52 pm**

Horse wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:11 am
Cousin Jack wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 9:57 am Has anyone ever ridden a il6? A bit wide for a bike, but Honda managed it.
Yes, Kawasaki Z1300. Big, wide, heavy (particularly if, relatively, you were a 9st wimp).

So did Benelli... years before either of the Japanese manufacturers.

There was also the famous inline 5 cylinder Honda, and I'm pretty sure someone built a five cylinder two stroke by chopping two Kawasaki triples together.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:56 pm**

Taipan wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:42 pm Probably easier to say which I liked the least which was a (Honda Hornet) 600 IL4. What an absolute waste of time! Flat as a witches tit below 10k. Constant changing up and down to get anything out of it, or it just bogged down. Hateful thing.

I've got one (an 02 model) and that's not the bike I recognise. Mine pulls from 2000 rpm (not quickly, admittedly but it won't bog down), and it's got enough midrange I can just leave it in 3rd and 4th on a twisty road.

It's far more flexible than was my GSX-R750WN, which had had a stage 2 'tune' which essentially stripped out all the mid-range so it went mental at 11k and drank fuel at 25 mpg.

You didn't have a similar 'performance' tune by any chance?

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:59 pm**

weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:35 pm
Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:26 pm
weeksy wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:28 am Everything APART from an IL4 for me.

I don't get that, I've got 3 inline 4s and they ride differently, one has 16 valves, one 20 and one 8, my FZR400 is all revs, no appreciable step in power and harder to ride fast than a two stroke, my FZ750 is smooth and sizeable but not powerful up to 8000rpm, then it screams round to 11000 and is quick, my Z1170 makes power from 2000 - 9000 and is all grunt, you can ride round and barely change gear, you can do a lap of Cadwell with about 10 gear changes.

The posts so far show that different people want different things, but also that some people want more than one engine type and enjoy different engine characteristics, I don't want to be limited to one engine type, I want to enjoy the variety of motorcycling.
I enjoy the variety too, I just hate IL4s, the way they sound, the way they scream, the way they make power, everything.

IL4s don't all do that (most car engines are IL4s). I guess sports 600s tend to.

Even the same engine, ie the K12, can be very different in different bikes. Great for touring, but then again, a flat twin or a triple can be.

The most horrible modern engine I've had was an upright twin - completely characterless, I loved the old 1150 flat twin, the later 1200 flat twin was a 'better' engine....but I didn't like the one I had as much as the 1150. I enjoyed my CX500 way back when but I suspect I wouldn't like it that much now. The only triple I tried was the oddly numbered 595...which seemed pretty epic on a French road (when no-one was watching

).

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:02 pm**

The Spin Doctor wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:52 pm
Horse wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:11 am
Cousin Jack wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 9:57 am Has anyone ever ridden a il6? A bit wide for a bike, but Honda managed it.
Yes, Kawasaki Z1300. Big, wide, heavy (particularly if, relatively, you were a 9st wimp).
So did Benelli... years before either of the Japanese manufacturers.

There was also the famous inline 5 cylinder Honda, and I'm pretty sure someone built a five cylinder two stroke by chopping two Kawasaki triples together.

Allan Millyard does the latter. What was the 5 cylinder inline Honda? A 125cc racing engine maybe?

Answered my own question, the RC148.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:05 pm**

Horse wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:53 pm Try an old BMW K100. Although you will hate the size, weight, handling, brakes, etc, I can assure you that the way it makes power is nothing like a UJM.

It will not scream

Power delivery has more in common with a diesel.

How an inline four delivers depends entirely on the tune. It's torque that makes a bike 'driveable', not HP.

Horse's BMW curve looks just like the torque curve of the XJ6 Yamaha - also tuned for mid-range and almost flat from 3k to about 9k. No point revving it over 10.

And it pulls from tickover. I found myself riding round an uphill hairpin in top gear in the Pyrenees because my brother was leading on his new BMW, had barely ridden in four or five years, and was glacially slow!

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:06 pm**

cheb wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:02 pm
Allan Millyard does the latter. What was the 5 cylinder inline Honda? A 125cc racing engine maybe?

Answered my own question, the RC148.

Millyard, of course...

And here's the Honda 125... sounds wonderful.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:10 pm**

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:17 pm I've also ridden a tandem twin two stroke

There was also a road-going Kawasaki 250 tandem twin, the KR250.

So many bikes I've never ridden!

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:16 pm**

The Spin Doctor wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:10 pm
Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:17 pm I've also ridden a tandem twin two stroke
There was also a road-going Kawasaki 250 tandem twin, the KR250.

So many bikes I've never ridden!

Andy Bolas who's in the VJMC has one, they're really small, about the same size as an AR125

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:17 pm**

The Spin Doctor wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:06 pm
cheb wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:02 pm
Allan Millyard does the latter. What was the 5 cylinder inline Honda? A 125cc racing engine maybe?

Answered my own question, the RC148.
Millyard, of course...

And here's the Honda 125... sounds wonderful.

That's tiny! You could get that stuck in your bum crack

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:25 pm**

Count Steer wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:17 pm That's tiny! You could get that stuck in your bum crack

You'll probably like this, then!

50cc, three cylinders.

Actually that might be the twin.

There's a video of the three cylinder engine here. This vid says there are no videos of it running.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:32 pm**

My nephew has a couple of racing 50cc bikes, with limited garage space he hangs them on the wall!

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:41 pm**

It's v twins all the way for me. I've ridden other engine configs and I'm fairly meh about them. Typically I like skinny bikes and prettier engines. My only exception seems to be an old skool goldwing motor, expected to hate, really liked.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 3:11 pm**

The Spin Doctor wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:56 pm
Taipan wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:42 pm Probably easier to say which I liked the least which was a (Honda Hornet) 600 IL4. What an absolute waste of time! Flat as a witches tit below 10k. Constant changing up and down to get anything out of it, or it just bogged down. Hateful thing.
I've got one (an 02 model) and that's not the bike I recognise. Mine pulls from 2000 rpm (not quickly, admittedly but it won't bog down), and it's got enough midrange I can just leave it in 3rd and 4th on a twisty road.

It's far more flexible than was my GSX-R750WN, which had had a stage 2 'tune' which essentially stripped out all the mid-range so it went mental at 11k and drank fuel at 25 mpg.

You didn't have a similar 'performance' tune by any chance?

No, it was a bog standard one. I got a loaner from Dobles one time which was a detuned, lower revving version with a low slung exhaust, Jesus that was unbelievable. Compare either to a SV650 for grunt and I just cant work out why anyone would want one?? MAybe if you're out on open roads where you can stretch its legs, it makes some some sense, but not round town, well to me anyway.

revtothelimit - motorbike forum

Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations

Re: Engine configurations