revtothelimit - motorbike forum

Maybe the right/ideal amount of bhp is the same formula for the optimum number of guitars to own.

The correct number is n+1, where n is the number of guitars (bhp) currently owned.

Cousin Jack wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:18 pm

Yorick wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:49 pm 200 BHP can be ridden gently without falling off. It's that clever twisty thing on the right handlebar

Very true, but modern* FI bikes don't like zero throttle, they fart and generally make for uncomfortable and jerky riding. A less powerful bike would let you give a whiff of throttle to smooth it all out, without going faster than you want to.

* Alternatively we could get a real-world emission test that didn't require such silly emissions at tickover.

That's bollox, WADR. My bike is sweet as anything at any revs.

Cousin Jack wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:18 pm
Very true, but modern* FI bikes don't like zero throttle, they fart and generally make for uncomfortable and jerky riding. A less powerful bike would let you give a whiff of throttle to smooth it all out, without going faster than you want to.

* Alternatively we could get a real-world emission test that didn't require such silly emissions at tickover.

Also helps if the engine has a heavier flywheel so won't react 'instantly' to that whiff of throttle, smoothing out changes.

My ZH2 is the best fuelled bike I've ever ridden, its fantastic pottering/filtering in heavy traffic, no snatchiness or jerks when going off a closed throttle, a pleasure to ride. And then it reveals its other side when the traffic clears and you add more than a whiff of throttle and the horizon leaps towards you at "ohhhhh shit"" speeds

MingtheMerciless wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:56 pm My ZH2 is the best fuelled bike I've ever ridden, its fantastic pottering/filtering in heavy traffic, no snatchiness or jerks when going off a closed throttle, a pleasure to ride.

The one that surprised me was a 916, slow speed up to traffic lights, etc, it was like a trials bike.

Yorick wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:36 pm That's bollox, WADR. My bike is sweet as anything at any revs..

Perhaps it's a Honda thing.

My VFR didn't like it.
My CB500 doesn't like it
A CBR650 I rode recently didn't like it.

mangocrazy wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:42 pm Bike weight is probably more important than anything these days to me, even more so than engine layout or BHP.

Yup one of the reasons I love the 690 it's so light on its wheels

I don't know about bhp, the only bike I had measured on a dyno was my CCM640. I'm happy with however much gets me to just over 100mph on a bike geared to not quite rev to the red line in top gear.

What's that going to be, 30 or 35bhp?

Cousin Jack wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:09 pm

Yorick wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:36 pm That's bollox, WADR. My bike is sweet as anything at any revs..

Perhaps it's a Honda thing.

My VFR didn't like it.
My CB500 doesn't like it
A CBR650 I rode recently didn't like it.

All medium price/power range. All the Jap sportsbikes run perfectly out of the box.

When I was instructing, I used to lead the sighting laps and usually did them in 6th for a giggle. The bikes handled Mallory hairpin and Cadwell Mountain and old Hairpin happily in 6th.

And in France, 2 up with luggage, they trundled through villages in 6th at 30 MPH and pulled away like a train.

cheb wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:17 pm I don't know about bhp, the only bike I had measured on a dyno was my CCM640. I'm happy with however much gets me to just over 100mph on a bike geared to not quite rev to the red line in top gear.

What's that going to be, 30 or 35bhp?

More like 40bhp, but a lot depends on aerodynamics, 250LCs would indicate 100mph, but at best were doing 95, they had about 35bhp, 350LCs would indicate 110mph on about 43bhp.

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:52 pm

cheb wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:17 pm I don't know about bhp, the only bike I had measured on a dyno was my CCM640. I'm happy with however much gets me to just over 100mph on a bike geared to not quite rev to the red line in top gear.

What's that going to be, 30 or 35bhp?

More like 40bhp, but a lot depends on aerodynamics, 250LCs would indicate 100mph, but at best were doing 95, they had about 35bhp, 350LCs would indicate 110mph on about 43bhp.

We used to max out in top at places like Snet with 1+ front sprocket

Maybe 45bhp then, as the bikes I like have the aerodynamics of a barn door, especially when I'm sat on them.

Two bikes Tracer 900 and Burgman 650
I like them both and enjoy riding them. The burg is 54bhp with a CVT so it will only rev at it's own pace best commuting machine ever and 54 bhp is more than enough. Jump on the Tracer pootle along then crack it open and big smiles. Cant fault either of them so BHP is not really a factor for me nice to have though. Had a ZZR1400 and admit doing silly speeds on it but the older I get the less HP I need

Le_Fromage_Grande wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:52 pm

cheb wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:17 pmjust over 100mph on a bike geared to not quite rev to the red line in top gear.

What's that going to be, 30 or 35bhp?

More like 40bhp, but a lot depends on aerodynamics, 250LCs would indicate 100mph, but at best were doing 95, they had about 35bhp, 350LCs would indicate 110mph on about 43bhp.

The 1970s 400Four was 37hp and would edge just over 100mph.

BMW R65, 1981 spec, was 50hp, would do 110mph.

My little Honda 400, which was nominally restricted to 33bhp, managed to bounce off its 180kmh/112mph limiter a couple of times, but that was with a stiff breeze and a decent hill.

It'd do an indicated tonne no problem on the flat. What that actually was I dunno, but several other people followed me also doing an indicated tonne at several times, including our very own RB.

It only had to drag the 18 year old me around though, I could hide behind lamp posts then.

Mr. Dazzle wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:56 pm It'd do an indicated tonne no problem on the flat.

Hold on, is that a metric 100mph or an Imperial100mph?

One hundred millilitres per hectare.

Yorick wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 10:08 am

fil2 wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 10:06 am

weeksy wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 8:12 am Seeing the Aprilia today with 215bhp it makes me question as always...


"who the heck wants 200+"

me...….! its simple innit really....better to have and not need that need and not have ! that's the truth of life !

Quite.

It really is a case of horses for courses- no pun intended, but Skub's post is the closest to my view I think in this thread.

I voted 100-120hp twin, but that is only a part of the story for me, and I want multiple choices.
Power alone doesn't define it for me, it is a combination of power and weight, and that 100-120 hp ( I'd happily up that to 150) , and KTM790/890/Street triple size and weight really is the most fun power and weight for me for a road bike.

But yeah, for trackdays, I have historically always wanted more than that.
I had my 2004 ZX10 for 14 years. Standard that had 150ish at the wheel, but as I ran it for its whole life with me as my track bike, a full titanium Akra system and custom map brought it up to a real 169rwhp.
Brilliant bike, plenty enough power to be lazy with the gearchanging if I wanted and still stay with my mates, terrific fun on a track and it also got me around them for a lot of years faster than anything else I've ever had- it was just about the perfect amount of usable power for me- I really could wring its neck, really can't honestly say I feel I can do that to the same degree with an S1000RR, 1199/1299 etc
And proving, for me, that more power isn't always best, at the far end of the spectrum was my H2- genuine 235hp at the wheel after the remap and
I reckon I was slower on just about any track on that than I would be on a decent 600, far too much for me, spent most of the time fighting it and trying to stop the fucker, it really was just too much (for me at least), but in fairness it wasn't just the power, the weight played a big factor- it's far too heavy and wore me out.

Of course, another category is off-roaders- I'm talking Green ( or Brown in the case of Yozza) laning here, not competitive Enduro riding.
This is another area where I don't agree with the many that a Serow/CR230/250 etc is best- yes I agree 20-25hp is all you need and you'll still have fun, , but a 450/500 4T or 250/300 smoker is just so much easier IME even going steady, and waaay more fun when trails open up and/or you want a certain sort of fun - again , in fairness weight plays a major part in this and the least powerful are ironically in this case also the heaviest

Then, at the other far end of the spectrum, there are the twist-and-go scoots with less than 10hp , which I still absolutely love for razzing about locally.

But the bottom line is if someone said to me I could only ever have one bike to cover every tarmac use then despite what I voted, it would still be an MT10-SP- does everything to a decent degree, is well equipped with nice build quality, and it has just the best road-bike engine ever that delivers 10/10 on the fun factor - so I guess on reflection, maybe I ought to change my answer to 150-220 in a V4 ....

Good post Tricky. You jogged my memory about your zx10r. Didn't you do a load of work to that bringing up to BSB standard?

Some folk think it's just about max power. My 2003 GSXR1000 had 100 BHP at only 6,000 revs, measured on a dyno.

That's great fun when you want to short shift and ride the torque wave.