Mallory Park.

[singlesman]

It’s been a few days but was back out with no2. son at Mallory on the 3rd.
Another track he’s able to ride with no license.
I must be a bit of a slow learner because despite it not working on his track debut at Lydden I thought it would be a good idea to enter novice again and try and show him around, the thinking being he’d be a fair bit quicker than on his first time out.
Well, from that point of view it was fine, and he once again had a fantastic time.
From a parental point of view it was feckin horrendous. Used to love Mallory and maybe in a quicker group it would be fine, but in novice it seems like a recipe for disaster.
It was carnage with large groups of bikes circulating together, hurtling into the chicane (edwina’s?) and the bus stop all over the track, wobbling around and then hurtling off down the next bit.
I hope this doesn’t come across as a dig at novice group riders because it’s really not meant to be that at all, thinks it’s mainly down to the stop start nature of the track, but also the incredibly aggressive riding from a bunch of mainly middle aged men who had to get in front at any cost.
Don’t remember ever being so worried on track ever, ( for the safety of my lad), and was thoroughly relieved to come away with him in one piece at the end of the day.
When we were chatting about it in the van on the way home he seem completely mystified by my concerns, couldn’t see an issue at all, guess that’s 21 year olds for you.
Anyway, Acu test day for him on Monday, so hopefully we’ll be able to get to some more flowing circuits, certainly won’t be rushing back to Leicestershire!

[Dodgy69]

Would inters be better for him.??

[Yorick]

I never enjoyed riding in the slow group. Was bloody scary sometimes

[singlesman]

@Dodgy knees really think it was the track layout causing the issues, just a shame that the guys and girls out there couldn’t work out that if they just backed off for a bit and found some space they’d have much more fun and also learn a bit more with some clear corners to play with.
He’s improved noticeably since Lydden but think inters would be a step too far at the moment.
@Yorick I think the thing that made it so scary at Mallory is the issue of track novices on some incredibly quick bikes, took a massive amount of willpower not to keep checking over my shoulder into the bottlenecks

[Yorick]

@Dodgy knees really think it was the track layout causing the issues, just a shame that the guys and girls out there couldn’t work out that if they just backed off for a bit and found some space they’d have much more fun and also learn a bit more with some clear corners to play with.
He’s improved noticeably since Lydden but think inters would be a step too far at the moment.
@Yorick I think the thing that made it so scary at Mallory is the issue of track novices on some incredibly quick bikes, took a massive amount of willpower not to keep checking over my shoulder into the bottlenecks

If you come across a big group, pull into pits and go to pit lane and back on track. You'll find clear track.

[Noggin]

Surely though novice group WILL be like that. It's Novice!!

People there are starting out,
learning confidence,
learning how to get round track corners (so different to road corners),
lacking in the confidence to know how fast/slow they can go into a corner,
finding out how hard/or not they need to brake into corners

It's not about 'working out' - it's learning. That takes a bit of time on a track and some confidence

Most TDO's offer free instruction but hardly anyone takes them up on that offer. Which is daft. It's free. But apparently almost everyone on track either doesn't want to get better or doesn't think they need to!! They'll get faster on the wrong lines and making errors and then go to inters, making the same errors etc etc

At least they are all doing similar. Your son didn't notice it so maybe, as a better rider, it feels worse to you than to the others?

For me, as a "fast through corners but slow on straights" rider, inters was much more scary than novice. Such a HUGE range of speed and skills - the ones that don't want to be the slow guy in fast or the ones that don't want to admit they NEED to be in novice!! And of course the odd racer that couldn't get into fast but booked inters for track practice and spends the day 'winning'!!

I bloody love Mallory. I did my first track day there (in a December on a Blackbird!) and part of the reason I love it is Because its technical (well, stop start/lots of different things to learn) and also because I could see the whole track from the middle!! My favourite bit is Gerards after the start/finish straight - even on the BB I could overtake people on the outside there in novice (didn't do it on the first day though! LOL). And on the track bike in inters!

Personally I think part of the issue is people go to track because they are fast on the road and think they will 'win' on track. It's so totally different.

As someone who very clearly remembers starting out on track (unlike most of the guys on here who are much more experienced) I'm reading that you think they all need to learn. Well, that's what novice is for!! Easy to criticise when you are far more experienced.

Would you teach your son to drive? All I've heard from friends is never teach family to drive. Does that roll over to TD's? You shouldn't be in novice based on your skills (from how I read this), so, would your son be happy with one of the instructors from the TDO?
That would take the pressure of you having to deal with novices on track (and maybe him having his Dad following him) so you could both enjoy it more (especially you by the sounds of it!!)

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

Sound advice from Yorick, find your own space and ride in it.

There are several problems with Novice group, but the main one is slow people on quick bikes, they're fast down the straights and won't overtake around corners, though a lot of them are unpredictable, making them difficult to overtake.

[singlesman]

@Noggin I nearly didn’t post the above thread as I was worried it would be taken the wrong way, it in no way was meant to be a criticism of novice group riders.
My only aim in going out in novice was to lead my son around on the correct lines, albeit at a very sedate pace in preparation for his Acu test day tomorrow. Then keep right out of the way for a bit while he figured things out for himself, then repeat.
Certainly wasn’t pressuring him by following.
Again, as mentioned above, while keeping out of the way, was just a bit surprised by the nature of the riding, ‘the must get in front before the next corner’ mentality which just looked so dodgy, and can’t have been any fun.
But you’re quite right and it is a learning process, just think an excess of male testosterone makes it much slower process than necessary for some

[singlesman]

Sorry to harp on, but guess you really had to be there, three long stops in the day waiting for the ambulances to pick up the casualties. All in novice!

[Le_Fromage_Grande]

I've got a bit pissed off with track days this year, I go in Novice because I'm not very quick and I'm on a 60bhp bike, I've done 3 wet track days this year, all of them had every morning session stopped due to people falling off, often on the first lap out, dry track days have been a bit better, but not much, it's like you have to get through the morning where all the idiots fall or go home, and then the afternoon is for the people who can ride for 20 minutes without binning it.

And from what I've seen inters and fast aren't much better.

[Skub]

I've got a bit pissed off with track days this year, I go in Novice because I'm not very quick and I'm on a 60bhp bike, I've done 3 wet track days this year, all of them had every morning session stopped due to people falling off, often on the first lap out, dry track days have been a bit better, but not much, it's like you have to get through the morning where all the idiots fall or go home, and then the afternoon is for the people who can ride for 20 minutes without binning it.

And from what I've seen inters and fast aren't much better.

It's because a lot of riders do a trackday like they ride on the road,where their mission seems to be to get past whatever the odds. Being ahead of someone you are 'racing' is a shit or bust scenario. They've never known what it's like to get a flow going,they are too ragged and frantic,full of tall tales and horseballs. Listen in on any conversation at biker meets and you'll hear it. Loose cannons.

[Yorick]

It always used to be Inters that were most trouble.
We were often told to park our bikes just off track at dangerous bits so they could see they were being watched.

[Noggin]

@Noggin I nearly didn’t post the above thread as I was worried it would be taken the wrong way, it in no way was meant to be a criticism of novice group riders.
My only aim in going out in novice was to lead my son around on the correct lines, albeit at a very sedate pace in preparation for his Acu test day tomorrow. Then keep right out of the way for a bit while he figured things out for himself, then repeat.
Certainly wasn’t pressuring him by following.
Again, as mentioned above, while keeping out of the way, was just a bit surprised by the nature of the riding, ‘the must get in front before the next corner’ mentality which just looked so dodgy, and can’t have been any fun.
But you’re quite right and it is a learning process, just think an excess of male testosterone makes it much slower process than necessary for some

No worries. I do sometimes get a bit frustrated with people complaining about the novice group, but often it's people that possibly can't remember how it felt to go out in novice and try and learn!!

I don't disagree with anything you've written, just wanted to put the flip side

Also - might be worth, next time, making use of the free instruction for your son - less stress for you for sure!!

Sorry to harp on, but guess you really had to be there, three long stops in the day waiting for the ambulances to pick up the casualties. All in novice!

I've seen a lot more of this (on FB cos obviously, not only have I not been over there, I've not been riding till this week!) - but in most groups

I wonder how much of it is that so many people have been unable to do TDs for 12-18 months and are now trying to get out/back out? Far too much enthusiasm, not enough skill?

Equally, I think testosterone is, to a degree, the problem - along with ego. Too many head to track cos the are sooo fast and obviously they have no need of instruction or advice. Even when they hurl their bike and themselves at the scenery it won't be their fault

[datsunman]

It's the nature of the beast at Mallory unfortunately, I ride there a reasonable amount and it's the same in the 'advanced' group. I used to back off for the start/finish straight but that's not enough now, pit in and out again usually does the job.

[Yorick]

It's the nature of the beast at Mallory unfortunately, I ride there a reasonable amount and it's the same in the 'advanced' group. I used to back off for the start/finish straight but that's not enough now, pit in and out again usually does the job.

You ride like a girl

[KungFooBob]

Another track he’s able to ride with no license.

Have you considered an ACU license, they're not difficult to get and all the tracks accept them.

[datsunman]

It's the nature of the beast at Mallory unfortunately, I ride there a reasonable amount and it's the same in the 'advanced' group. I used to back off for the start/finish straight but that's not enough now, pit in and out again usually does the job.

You ride like a girl

How rude.

It's all you lot on your straight line bikes that get in the way!

[singlesman]

@KungFooBob Did hit Acu test today sir, but license won’t be issued until 2022.
As you say, will give him a lot more choices.

[KungFooBob]

I had to redo my license test (6 or 7 years ago) after a 6 year lay off.

I think I did it with NGRRC, the instructor reckoned only half the applicants ever went racing and a large number were disqualified drivers who still wanted to do trackdays.

[Noggin]

It's the nature of the beast at Mallory unfortunately, I ride there a reasonable amount and it's the same in the 'advanced' group. I used to back off for the start/finish straight but that's not enough now, pit in and out again usually does the job.

You ride like a girl

How rude.

It's all you lot on your straight line bikes that get in the way!

Ex-cuse-me


Nothing wrong with riding like a girl - well, some girls!! (Not me at the moment!! )