Couchy wrote: Thu Apr 14, 2022 2:32 pm
You can’t connect a car charger direct to a PME system in the UK.
Why?
If the neutral drops out which is quite common on our old systems then the return path for the current is through the earth, the metal car being on rubber tyres would be that return path if someone touched it. It’s because if our failing system that we link earth and neutral together which creates the possibility of this. We’re the only country that do it. Cars should have been class 2 then it wouldn’t be an issue. But as no one else has the PME it wasn’t thought of. BS7671 originally said to TT all car chargers but then you have the issue of earth rods and installing them. Also an issue if a car is on a TT system and someone takes a vacuum cleaner in on a different earth you get a potential between them. So the regs banned connecting to PME and referred to a device that didn’t exist, an open neutral device when now exists and disconnects earth and all live terminals from the car in the event of a lost neutral. A lost neutral would send all the current from the local transformer through the car if the car was grounded by a person. The reality is if a neutral is lost there are many other paths back but I guess none so clear as a metal bodied car.
It’s stuff like this and DC sensitive RCD that most electricians miss.
Last edited by Couchy on Thu Apr 14, 2022 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
With regards to tax on electric for fuel, every charger installed with a grant has had a smart meter in it, this is on an open protocol over the cell network, doesn’t take a genius to work out this will be used to tax electric used as fuel. Also tax per mile will be implemented as every electric car has a network connection. Once this is all in you’ll wish you had the cheap ICE car.
Motoring will get more expensive as ICE cars are priced off the road, those on lower wages wont be able to afford them, no worry apart from those on lower wages need a car to work at the warehouses etc we need to survive. There’s no real answer to this as these people can’t get finance to lease a vehicle and the £1500 cars they drive now will be priced off the road
Potter wrote: Thu Apr 14, 2022 3:26 pm
Once EVs are more common the road tax for zero emission vehicles will be implemented, I don't know what grading they will use, but it will be punitive no doubt, electricity will also be hammered by extra tax additions to pay for the extra infrastructure.
Once everyone is totally dependant on electrons to get around then the government will milk it to the maximum.
I can't see them making ICE vehicles a cheaper option.
I was going to do a new thread about recent and upcoming green taxes. The Plastic Packaging Tax hit earlier in April and Extended Producer Responsibility can't be far off. Both will reach directly into the pockets of the man on the street.
The polluters are already paying more. And there's more to come.
To a kid looking up to me, life ain't nothing but bitches and money.
Asian Boss wrote: Thu Apr 14, 2022 5:08 pm
The polluters are already paying more. And there's more to come.
The EV users are paying as well. It already costs circa £45 to fill up a Tesla at a public charger. I think a lot of small engine/diesel cars will give a better cost/mile ratio.
Mr. Dazzle wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 5:46 pm
As I've mentioned elsewhere here, we're not doing the employee car scheme this year - it'd be a 60 week wait, so there's no point!
Although, next year, they won't suddenly clear 60 weeks of backlog and revert to 'usual' waiting time.
The employee scheme is made up of the cars which aren't selling super well though. Its cheaper to keep the lines going and soak up the supply with employees!
Theory doesn't work when they can't even make enough full price cars though.
So chatting to an owner of the new Skoda enyaq, front tyres were worn at 4K miles, £700 a pair. That’s the money saved on fuel gone on tyres. My similar diesel suv does 5x that on tyres. What’s the carbon footprint of tyres ?
Chatting to a mate who owns a big tyre depot and he sees a lot of bigger EV’s getting through tyres at similar miles
Couchy wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 10:17 pm
So chatting to an owner of the new Skoda enyaq, front tyres were worn at 4K miles, £700 a pair. That’s the money saved on fuel gone on tyres. My similar diesel suv does 5x that on tyres. What’s the carbon footprint of tyres ?
Chatting to a mate who owns a big tyre depot and he sees a lot of bigger EV’s getting through tyres at similar miles
Why is that do you think ?
At 70 mph ANY engine needs same horse power to do that speed.
Couchy wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 10:17 pm
So chatting to an owner of the new Skoda enyaq, front tyres were worn at 4K miles, £700 a pair. That’s the money saved on fuel gone on tyres. My similar diesel suv does 5x that on tyres. What’s the carbon footprint of tyres ?
Chatting to a mate who owns a big tyre depot and he sees a lot of bigger EV’s getting through tyres at similar miles
Why is that do you think ?
At 70 mph ANY engine needs same horse power to do that speed.
Mainly down to weight I guess. (That, and the fact that they tend to be pretty quick from 0 to 30 so people probably enjoy the traffic light GP more often...that'll wear tyres out quite nicely).
Couchy wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 10:17 pm
So chatting to an owner of the new Skoda enyaq, front tyres were worn at 4K miles, £700 a pair. That’s the money saved on fuel gone on tyres. My similar diesel suv does 5x that on tyres. What’s the carbon footprint of tyres ?
Chatting to a mate who owns a big tyre depot and he sees a lot of bigger EV’s getting through tyres at similar miles
Why is that do you think ?
At 70 mph ANY engine needs same horse power to do that speed.
Mainly down to weight I guess. (That, and the fact that they tend to be pretty quick from 0 to 30 so people probably enjoy the traffic light GP more often...that'll wear tyres out quite nicely).
Reverse that - acceleration will be the biggest factor esp with fwd. Weight? The Enyaq weighs about the same as my car and my tyres are doing fine.
Yep, it’s acceleration that rips the fuck out of tyres.
Electric cars accelerate well. My last car which was a quick fwd went through a set of fronts in 8k and I thought that was bad. My current navara is on 18k and I don’t think they’re half worn yet.
Couchy wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 10:17 pm
So chatting to an owner of the new Skoda enyaq, front tyres were worn at 4K miles, £700 a pair. That’s the money saved on fuel gone on tyres. My similar diesel suv does 5x that on tyres. What’s the carbon footprint of tyres ?
Chatting to a mate who owns a big tyre depot and he sees a lot of bigger EV’s getting through tyres at similar miles
Why is that do you think ?
At 70 mph ANY engine needs same horse power to do that speed.
Mainly down to weight I guess. (That, and the fact that they tend to be pretty quick from 0 to 30 so people probably enjoy the traffic light GP more often...that'll wear tyres out quite nicely).
Skoda Enyaq = 1850kg. Oof!
AFAIK they're all either RWD or rear-biased four wheel drive though, like most EVs these days. So if you're wearing out just the front tyres it's almost certainly 'cause you're coming into the braking zones super hot or understeering your way around roundabouts in a cloud of tyre screech. Either way it's weight rather than the innate EVness which is killing the fronts, IYSWIM.
Yorick wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 11:20 pm
Why is that do you think ?
At 70 mph ANY engine needs same horse power to do that speed.
Mainly down to weight I guess. (That, and the fact that they tend to be pretty quick from 0 to 30 so people probably enjoy the traffic light GP more often...that'll wear tyres out quite nicely).
Skoda Enyaq = 1850kg. Oof!
AFAIK they're all either RWD or rear-biased four wheel drive though, like most EVs these days. So if you're wearing out just the front tyres it's almost certainly 'cause you're coming into the braking zones super hot or understeering your way around roundabouts in a cloud of tyre screech. Either way it's weight rather than the innate EVness which is killing the fronts, IYSWIM.
Gotta be the weight and the power, no one seems to be mentioning the tyres in running costs or how bad they are for the environment....
I do wonder if it's just 'cause EVs are faster than they let on...by which I mean, it's very easy to drive one faster and harder than you think you are, simply because the usual signs (engine noise basically) aren't there. Couple that with the fact that EVs are generally very fast off the line and at normal road speeds. Thus you find yourself braking and cornering harder than you normally would, without even meaning to.
