Zwift, riding and racing.... update thread, info thread, motivational thread.

[Crosshair]

Ugggh! The schedule is a bit shite. Was hoping for a beefy race to use as a workout replacement this evening but it’s all rubbish! And the number are pretty low- even for summer I’d have thought

It almost seems like there’s too many races on now!

May have to go and bledge around Greater London Flat in ERG mode for a workout instead

[weeksy]

Ugggh! The schedule is a bit shite. Was hoping for a beefy race to use as a workout replacement this evening but it’s all rubbish! And the number are pretty low- even for summer I’d have thought

It almost seems like there’s too many races on now!

May have to go and bledge around Greater London Flat in ERG mode for a workout instead

The races often fill up closer to the time, but it does surprise me how few riders actually race.. 17.15 looks perfect for you though, couple of decent ups in there for the workout and a decent distance.

[Crosshair]

Easy day today

Last week I ended up doing a 3x10 threshold workout first and then some bonkers reverse Titans Grove B race for 30 mins

Looking dry tomorrow so better get out on the gravel bike for 3x15’s

[weeksy]

https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=3113993

Offt that was an effort... On lap 3, the As who'd set off in front of us by 2 mins came past and unusually for Zwift we could see them.... So i jumped on.. but the pace was too high for me... One guy stayed in though i think.

We started shelling riders from there on, especially when the Bs mixed up with us and then a few As... it was all over the place. I was sitting in a group of 20 but it was getting hard as the As would push on and the lighter guys go with them on the hill, then chaos.... I hung in and nearly went, then hung in again... then again... Finally on lap 10 i let it go and stayed with a small group... it then went crazy again with up and down, A, B, C riders all over the place.. In the end i lost a wheel... but caught the same guy for the line...

Lots of DQs so you never really knew where you were.... was a bonkers race overall.

[Crosshair]

I’m in two minds about Zwift autocat.
On the one hand, I can see how people deliberately catting down can alter the dynamics of a race. (Even if later filtered out on ZP)

On the other, I think everyone is paying their subscription to use Zwift as a tool and sometimes, beating up on D’s might be motivation to train without going too deep

On balance I probably think it’s a good thing.

So with that in mind- I’m gonna take what Zwift gives me and “at current fatness” (and with not much recent racing) it actually let me race C in the w/kg Crit City race

What followed was a bit of a masterclass in how to properly ride a Zwift course. I was literally only spending watts where I needed and then coasting or drafting as much as possible.

It was quite a long one- 16 laps, and gradually the C’s started whittling down. I was really lucky with power ups! I skipped one lap to save a feather for the end but otherwise, had 14! The ‘Prime’ hill was of course the tough part but with the PU’s and a lot of watts, I was often in the top 3!
I would start near the front on the approach, then let half the field pass me on the cobbles and then launch once I had plenty of draft in front of me.
I’d use the Draft PU before the cobbles, the feather at the stone bridge, and save the aero until the top so it was still having an effect into the next descent.

A few attacks went but I was able to either coast into them and go with them whilst the field chased or follow the bunch back on.

Sadly, the amount of watts I needed to get up the hill each lap meant I had no sprint whatsoever. But I held the lead group to the line.

I’d have been 4th in A Or 10th in B but won C.

And to prove how good my Crit skills were- I didn’t even break 3.2w/kg

Annoyingly, I was still able to do 333np which shows it’s weight that’s my problem, not watts!

[Crosshair]

Ha that’s funny! One of the guys from our chaingang was riding! He usually beats me IRL too, although I did get him one once this year when I left the gravel bike at home.
He got me by two seconds in the sprint tonight

[weeksy]

That's why I love Zwift races. They're just fine fun.

I did one today, I was properly shite. I knew I was before I started though. So after 1/2 way I let the lead group go and just cruised round for a bit

[Crosshair]

Yep! From that first day in 2015 when we still used to race by meeting at the start banner and shouting “GOGOGO!” in chat, I’ve enjoyed it!
I remember climbing next to a guy, both of us going flat out to beat the other up Richmond and realising it felt exactly like racing Mtb’s at a Gorrick had felt!

[weeksy]

I just tried a road bike again. Grabbed it out of the garage over the road, threw some air in the tyres and off we went.

Weirdly for me i didn't have a HRM fitted which made racing interesting.. but also OK... at times i had no idea what my HR was

In some ways I like how they make power, it does in some ways seem easier than the hybrid to increase power and in some ways to cruise too.
But they’re really not nice on hands/arms for me, even trying various positions didn’t help much. The legs were a bit of the dead side before starting as the 417 day on Monday killed them, but i wanted another ride before BPW on Friday. The roadie seems to pick up speed better, from say 200w trying to get 400w comes a lot easier i think.

https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=3110927

I tried 3 times to break, one of the me and 4 others managed 3s on the group, but as with most C races, it ended in a sprint. I’d flogged myself too much trying to break it up.

[weeksy]

Zwift racing continues to frustrate on the semi-flat courses. Everyone seems content to just sit and wait for the final 300m.

Yesterday i split the bunch 4 times... one of them was almost there, we got 6s in a group of 6 riders..but only 3 of us were prepared to put in a shift and after 3km we got pulled back... I went again, but only me.... then again, but only 1 other... It's just frustrating. I can sit and blame my trainer for a crappy sprint, but i don't know if i'm just crap at sprinting lol.. but the final 400m people just have 1000w kicks and i don't have that. So i end up looking for 'something' and needing something magical to get a decent placing... it rarely happens.

But i just can't stand sitting and waiting for a sprint, it's just dull.

[tricol]

Well, my knee pain has turned into lower limb pain. In a pretty shit situation right now. Everything hurts, both legs now, and I'm not confident of things improving anytime soon. Haven't booked any races this year, that will have to wait, and I hope I can get better this year.

[Crosshair]

Zwift racing continues to frustrate on the semi-flat courses. Everyone seems content to just sit and wait for the final 300m.

Yesterday i split the bunch 4 times... one of them was almost there, we got 6s in a group of 6 riders..but only 3 of us were prepared to put in a shift and after 3km we got pulled back... I went again, but only me.... then again, but only 1 other... It's just frustrating. I can sit and blame my trainer for a crappy sprint, but i don't know if i'm just crap at sprinting lol.. but the final 400m people just have 1000w kicks and i don't have that. So i end up looking for 'something' and needing something magical to get a decent placing... it rarely happens.

But i just can't stand sitting and waiting for a sprint, it's just dull.

I like 0.7 miles to go for a flier. Give that a try
When I raced on Tuesday in C's, it was a strange race where there was a long 7 mile hilly lead-in and then 6 laps of a 3 mile flat part of Richmond. I had no chance of holding the lead bunch through the hills so I sat up and waited for the guys 40s back and from that point was racing for 10th.
I don't like the Pack Dynamics 4.0 as when I was in the bunch, riding at 300w pulled my Avatar out of the front. But if I got up the road a little way and rode at 300w, the pack would claw me back despite nobody seemingly pulling any harder. Odd.

Anyway- I decided to go at one lap to go and just sat at 320w for 7min21 to stay away

[Crosshair]

Well, my knee pain has turned into lower limb pain. In a pretty shit situation right now. Everything hurts, both legs now, and I'm not confident of things improving anytime soon. Haven't booked any races this year, that will have to wait, and I hope I can get better this year.

That's crappy Sorry to hear that.

[Timmy]

Zwift is all about w/kg, out inthe real world that only dominates going uphill.

"i don't know if i'm just crap at sprinting lol.. but the final 400m people just have 1000w kicks and i don't have that" - I think you've answered your own question

[weeksy]

Zwift is all about w/kg, out inthe real world that only dominates going uphill.

"i don't know if i'm just crap at sprinting lol.. but the final 400m people just have 1000w kicks and i don't have that" - I think you've answered your own question

Dunno, i find it hard to believe the rest of the universe are all sprint gods and i'm completely shite...

https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=3575539

I did get a bit of a half-OK one yesterday for 3rd... but i'm wondering if my calibration was correct.

[Timmy]

Zwift is biased towards lighter riders in the most part. For you to do 1000w at 85kg, you have to do 11.8w/kg. The guy who placed 2nd in that race you linked is 67kg. He only has to do 790w to do the same watts per kg. Granted you've got more weight on the pedal but sprinting isn't necessarily about weight, more torque (generated by your muscles) and cadence. Also, your peak power 15s power was lower than 1st and 2nd places suggesting that you aren't a fast twitch type person.

[Crosshair]

At the same w/kg (how Zwift is catted), heavier riders actually have an advantage. On the flats, it’s 5.5kph difference for a 100 v 50kg rider doing 4w/kg.

https://zwiftinsider.com/wkg-tests/

Obviously racing is dynamic so that’s not how it always plays out.

I tried a few form sprints in a race yesterday, just managed to top 1000w but only just. By contrast, they were 1100 to 1200 when I did some outside the other week.

Did a pleasing high cadence drill where I managed 147rpm without bouncing in the saddle too

[weeksy]

Yesterday and the day before i tried some break-aways... it's just so so hard with pack dynamics. Like yourself i was watching and i had a 6s gap, but even though i was 3.5w/kg at the time, the bunch closed it despite me not seeing any of them hitting 3.5 lol.
It's spoiling the racing for me though massively as it's just 20-25 in a bunch every bloody race... in the bigger bunches it's 50 coming into the last 1.5km... Which is just a bit daft. Obviously the answer is "race in a race type that will split"... but the problem with that logic is, that's uphill and i can't go uphill like a 70kg C rider...
So i'm kind of in the worst of both worlds.
I'd love the pack/bunch stuff to be a little more realistic where if i pull a gap the bugger have to at least put in a shift to close it. But testing it yesterday when someone else pulled a gap, again he was closed, despite me making very little in the way of effort.

[Crosshair]

If it’s any consolation, holding a gap is chuffing hard IRL too
But at least in real life someone in the bunch has to do the pulling. In Zwift, the suction effect of merely coming through to the front seems to snowball a group ever faster without anyone picking up the bill.

As a ‘bigger than the pack’ rider, it’s actually most efficient to attack over the climb. So try and hang with the leaders up, then when they are easing off to coast, sprint hard preferably until you hit supertuck speed.
Then the only chance is that some others make it away with you. Solo attacks seem to last no more than about 45 seconds
That’s also helped if you drive the pace hard into the climb. Which makes it quite a long effort